1 00:00:31,939 --> 00:00:21,830 [Music] 2 00:00:38,819 --> 00:00:35,579 now your electrifying hosts of exploring 3 00:00:55,110 --> 00:00:38,829 the bizarre Timothy Begley and team 4 00:00:58,009 --> 00:00:55,120 sports like that it's almost Showtime 5 00:00:59,670 --> 00:00:58,019 [Music] 6 00:01:01,890 --> 00:00:59,680 what's the matter 7 00:01:06,179 --> 00:01:01,900 why'd you wake me I was just getting 8 00:01:09,660 --> 00:01:06,189 ready for tonight's program I don't know 9 00:01:12,630 --> 00:01:09,670 looks like Muhammad Ali had has hits you 10 00:01:15,899 --> 00:01:12,640 at a sucker punch I don't I don't think 11 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:15,909 you were ever going to move and what are 12 00:01:21,179 --> 00:01:17,650 you talking about getting ready for 13 00:01:24,179 --> 00:01:21,189 tonight's show you were fast asleep so a 14 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:24,189 deep alpha state trying to utilize my 15 00:01:28,169 --> 00:01:26,890 dreams to tap into higher dimensions to 16 00:01:31,050 --> 00:01:28,179 see the future and raise my 17 00:01:33,209 --> 00:01:31,060 consciousness something you have to 18 00:01:35,429 --> 00:01:33,219 watch out for there was those referring 19 00:01:38,160 --> 00:01:35,439 nightmares sometimes they could just be 20 00:01:41,819 --> 00:01:38,170 too much as dreaming can be rather 21 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:41,829 combative well once again you're proving 22 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:44,770 that you're a saintly individual Tim but 23 00:01:51,270 --> 00:01:48,130 I should get your ass out of bed and 24 00:01:54,419 --> 00:01:51,280 let's head to the KCUR studio so we can 25 00:01:58,580 --> 00:01:54,429 find out how we can best confront our 26 00:02:02,639 --> 00:01:58,590 nightmares sweet dreams till sunbeams 27 00:02:06,569 --> 00:02:02,649 find you sweet dreams that leave all 28 00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:06,579 worries behind you but in the dreams 29 00:02:16,290 --> 00:02:09,490 whatever they be a dream a little dream 30 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:16,300 of me well I guess I'm awake now Tim and 31 00:02:29,070 --> 00:02:24,730 I'm sure the orders at this point not 32 00:02:32,190 --> 00:02:29,080 too bad I always didn't want a second 33 00:02:32,790 --> 00:02:32,200 career as a musician actually I did sing 34 00:02:35,580 --> 00:02:32,800 a couple of 35 00:02:40,290 --> 00:02:35,590 times you know they're at one of the 36 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:40,300 conferences in in Arizona would Patrick 37 00:02:49,920 --> 00:02:45,810 Mraz was there that night from yes and 38 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:49,930 sang on the stage at Webster Hall in New 39 00:02:55,080 --> 00:02:52,690 York but it's it's not it's something 40 00:02:58,140 --> 00:02:55,090 that I only do to entertain my friends 41 00:03:00,300 --> 00:02:58,150 and our audience here it's so how are 42 00:03:02,220 --> 00:03:00,310 you doing out there in Jasper Indiana 43 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:02,230 got a cold spell and they are 44 00:03:11,370 --> 00:03:08,130 entertained and cold snowy say this um 45 00:03:14,340 --> 00:03:11,380 yes it's going it's going to be but then 46 00:03:16,890 --> 00:03:14,350 again I mean were we're a thick skin 47 00:03:19,680 --> 00:03:16,900 Midwesterners so you know there's not 48 00:03:23,340 --> 00:03:19,690 too much bothers us well I know Diane 49 00:03:25,710 --> 00:03:23,350 testman and Iowa was snowed in she had 50 00:03:29,450 --> 00:03:25,720 to get a neighbor to come over with the 51 00:03:31,980 --> 00:03:29,460 snowplow and get her in the animals out 52 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:31,990 to the house so she could do a little 53 00:03:38,220 --> 00:03:35,530 shopping and all but we have a great 54 00:03:40,860 --> 00:03:38,230 show tonight I'm looking forward to this 55 00:03:43,860 --> 00:03:40,870 because I've actually known our guests 56 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:43,870 for over a decade but I don't know our 57 00:03:46,650 --> 00:03:45,370 guests I mean I kind of know where I 58 00:03:47,900 --> 00:03:46,660 guess but I could know our guests better 59 00:03:50,670 --> 00:03:47,910 and I guess by the end of the night 60 00:03:52,110 --> 00:03:50,680 we'll all be dreaming together I was 61 00:04:02,220 --> 00:03:52,120 gonna say sleeping together but you know 62 00:04:05,340 --> 00:04:02,230 what I mean onward and upward so why 63 00:04:07,740 --> 00:04:05,350 don't you take us away that's what the 64 00:04:11,220 --> 00:04:07,750 program is going to be all and out this 65 00:04:12,900 --> 00:04:11,230 evening yeah well sure it'd be my 66 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:12,910 pleasure Tim well I I'm really happy 67 00:04:19,530 --> 00:04:16,690 that tonight our guest is Lex lone hood 68 00:04:22,470 --> 00:04:19,540 Nover now Lex has been the web producer 69 00:04:24,750 --> 00:04:22,480 for coast-to-coast am America's most 70 00:04:26,430 --> 00:04:24,760 popular overnight radio show at the 71 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:26,440 exception of exploring bizarre Thursday 72 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:27,970 nights at 10:00 p.m. Eastern Standard 73 00:04:35,790 --> 00:04:33,370 Time he's been with a Cuzco since 2002 74 00:04:38,850 --> 00:04:35,800 and was a longtime a features writer for 75 00:04:40,950 --> 00:04:38,860 after dark the the show's affiliated 76 00:04:43,469 --> 00:04:40,960 print magazine now over the last 17 77 00:04:45,360 --> 00:04:43,479 years Lex's work has been read by 78 00:04:46,170 --> 00:04:45,370 millions of people and he has earned 79 00:04:48,510 --> 00:04:46,180 respect 80 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:48,520 for his keen ability to evaluate the 81 00:04:54,090 --> 00:04:51,370 often esoteric and complex material 82 00:04:56,909 --> 00:04:54,100 presented by Gaston Coast to Coast AM 83 00:04:59,400 --> 00:04:56,919 his illuminating yet precise summaries 84 00:05:01,890 --> 00:04:59,410 and articles stand out as a valuable 85 00:05:04,409 --> 00:05:01,900 database and resource for those studying 86 00:05:06,950 --> 00:05:04,419 a wide range of topics including the 87 00:05:09,390 --> 00:05:06,960 paranormal fringe science science and 88 00:05:11,790 --> 00:05:09,400 alternate theories which are our bread 89 00:05:13,980 --> 00:05:11,800 and butter as well now Lex emerged as a 90 00:05:16,710 --> 00:05:13,990 visual and performance artists in the 91 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:16,720 early 1990s San Francisco and went on to 92 00:05:22,379 --> 00:05:19,930 create and run offbeat a web magazine 93 00:05:23,939 --> 00:05:22,389 for the San Francisco Chronicle about 94 00:05:27,300 --> 00:05:23,949 the off the beaten track art and culture 95 00:05:30,270 --> 00:05:27,310 have celebrated the electricity's and 96 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:30,280 creativity of San Francisco and its 97 00:05:37,499 --> 00:05:33,370 denizens has created several screen and 98 00:05:40,080 --> 00:05:37,509 stage plays and a graphic novella now 99 00:05:44,070 --> 00:05:40,090 nightmare land travels at the borders of 100 00:05:46,290 --> 00:05:44,080 sleep dream and wakefulness is his first 101 00:05:49,469 --> 00:05:46,300 nonfiction book that's what we'll be 102 00:05:53,629 --> 00:05:49,479 discussing tonight sweet dreams 103 00:05:56,550 --> 00:05:53,639 nightmares and other Shadow Realm 104 00:05:58,320 --> 00:05:56,560 desires so Lex great to have you with 105 00:06:00,750 --> 00:05:58,330 you with us tonight on exploring the 106 00:06:02,879 --> 00:06:00,760 bizarre well thank you so much for 107 00:06:07,110 --> 00:06:02,889 having me on it's it's a double pleasure 108 00:06:11,670 --> 00:06:07,120 to speak to to Tim's yeah there you go 109 00:06:15,779 --> 00:06:11,680 hey you know ah dreams something about 110 00:06:19,140 --> 00:06:15,789 dreams kind of frightens me you know and 111 00:06:20,760 --> 00:06:19,150 and some people believe that we're 112 00:06:22,710 --> 00:06:20,770 actually living in a dream state and 113 00:06:24,839 --> 00:06:22,720 when we fall asleep at night it's just a 114 00:06:27,450 --> 00:06:24,849 matter of going into another parallel 115 00:06:30,060 --> 00:06:27,460 dream state it's it's all very weird and 116 00:06:35,100 --> 00:06:30,070 and I have had some precognitive 117 00:06:38,640 --> 00:06:35,110 experiences you know during a sleep I 118 00:06:42,800 --> 00:06:38,650 can't say that sleep of frightens me but 119 00:06:46,050 --> 00:06:42,810 I always do either sleep at night or the 120 00:06:49,800 --> 00:06:46,060 the TV there's just something that 121 00:06:53,670 --> 00:06:49,810 perplexes me about the the the realm of 122 00:06:57,240 --> 00:06:53,680 the after hours and after dark in fact I 123 00:06:59,939 --> 00:06:57,250 think let Alexis probably when I first 124 00:07:01,559 --> 00:06:59,949 stepped met you you were editing 125 00:07:05,459 --> 00:07:01,569 after dark which was the official 126 00:07:09,779 --> 00:07:05,469 newsletter of Costa Coast that's right 127 00:07:11,490 --> 00:07:09,789 we did a Q&A way back when and we did 128 00:07:15,420 --> 00:07:11,500 we've done actually we've done a lot of 129 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:15,430 quite a bit of work together but the 130 00:07:22,770 --> 00:07:19,930 dreams now you know when I first became 131 00:07:27,619 --> 00:07:22,780 aware of the connection between dreams 132 00:07:31,260 --> 00:07:27,629 and and the paranormal I had a friend of 133 00:07:34,619 --> 00:07:31,270 mine by the name of Ronnie sunshine I 134 00:07:37,679 --> 00:07:34,629 know that kind of sounds weird but that 135 00:07:40,830 --> 00:07:37,689 was his that was his name and he was a 136 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:40,840 participant in an experiment that took 137 00:07:46,589 --> 00:07:43,810 place at Maimonides dream Hospital in 138 00:07:50,580 --> 00:07:46,599 Portland and it was a project that was 139 00:07:53,909 --> 00:07:50,590 headed by dr. Stanley critter and they 140 00:07:56,909 --> 00:07:53,919 had a an experienced experiment where 141 00:08:00,149 --> 00:07:56,919 they had an individual in in one room 142 00:08:05,420 --> 00:08:00,159 and that individual happened to be Jerry 143 00:08:08,790 --> 00:08:05,430 Garcia of the Grateful Dead and they had 144 00:08:14,899 --> 00:08:08,800 Ronnie sunshine in another part of the 145 00:08:18,990 --> 00:08:14,909 lab and they were trying to let's see 146 00:08:21,809 --> 00:08:19,000 project images during the the dream 147 00:08:24,329 --> 00:08:21,819 state and I don't remember the exact 148 00:08:27,930 --> 00:08:24,339 outcome of it I think they did have some 149 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:27,940 positive results but that's the first 150 00:08:36,959 --> 00:08:30,490 that I became really aware that there 151 00:08:40,500 --> 00:08:36,969 must be something a little paranormal or 152 00:08:42,839 --> 00:08:40,510 could be paranormal about the dreams now 153 00:08:46,050 --> 00:08:42,849 how did you first get hooked up with the 154 00:08:47,910 --> 00:08:46,060 the subject I mean out of all the topics 155 00:08:51,840 --> 00:08:47,920 you could have picked you to write a 156 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:51,850 book it's it's one that I don't think 157 00:08:55,980 --> 00:08:53,410 really has been written about all that 158 00:08:59,670 --> 00:08:55,990 much at least not in the a paranormal 159 00:09:02,340 --> 00:08:59,680 sense yeah I mean I think what sets my 160 00:09:05,870 --> 00:09:02,350 research apart from a lot of other books 161 00:09:07,800 --> 00:09:05,880 on dreaming is that I'm not doing 162 00:09:09,990 --> 00:09:07,810 interpretations or kind of like a 163 00:09:12,950 --> 00:09:10,000 dictionary if you dream that your teeth 164 00:09:15,260 --> 00:09:12,960 are falling out this means that 165 00:09:18,830 --> 00:09:15,270 it really was more of an X what became 166 00:09:21,310 --> 00:09:18,840 an exploration into this idea that 167 00:09:24,530 --> 00:09:21,320 there's this kind of blending or 168 00:09:26,750 --> 00:09:24,540 intermingling between these three main 169 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:26,760 states of consciousness which we I guess 170 00:09:34,310 --> 00:09:29,730 you could refer to as being awake being 171 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:34,320 asleep and then REM the REM dream state 172 00:09:40,100 --> 00:09:37,650 or rapid eye movement and how these 173 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:40,110 different states kind of have these odd 174 00:09:45,470 --> 00:09:42,810 blends almost like these cocktails of 175 00:09:49,010 --> 00:09:45,480 consciousness and what struck me about 176 00:09:52,250 --> 00:09:49,020 it was how a lot of like paranormal and 177 00:09:54,530 --> 00:09:52,260 odd activity seemed to kind of get 178 00:09:57,410 --> 00:09:54,540 nestled in between these states 179 00:09:59,510 --> 00:09:57,420 certainly a lot of the reports of 180 00:10:02,000 --> 00:09:59,520 strange things that I've heard on coast 181 00:10:05,300 --> 00:10:02,010 to coast over the years involved people 182 00:10:08,300 --> 00:10:05,310 like waking up and then seeing an entity 183 00:10:11,210 --> 00:10:08,310 at the end of their bed and so is that 184 00:10:14,450 --> 00:10:11,220 happening in the hypnagogic state which 185 00:10:17,270 --> 00:10:14,460 is in between sleep and dreams is kind 186 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:17,280 of kind of a window into these different 187 00:10:23,510 --> 00:10:20,370 where we can tune in to these different 188 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:23,520 states of mind that that don't happen 189 00:10:29,570 --> 00:10:26,730 when we're completely awake well how 190 00:10:32,300 --> 00:10:29,580 about how about any experiences of your 191 00:10:36,770 --> 00:10:32,310 own that you might note that have to do 192 00:10:38,690 --> 00:10:36,780 with the dream state well certainly 193 00:10:41,030 --> 00:10:38,700 there are sleep paralysis which I've had 194 00:10:43,850 --> 00:10:41,040 a couple of episodes of in my lifetime 195 00:10:45,740 --> 00:10:43,860 and that was something that got my 196 00:10:47,900 --> 00:10:45,750 curiosity up it was one of the first 197 00:10:52,010 --> 00:10:47,910 articles I wrote for after dark going 198 00:10:55,190 --> 00:10:52,020 all the way back to I think 2001 and at 199 00:10:57,920 --> 00:10:55,200 the time it wasn't that widely known now 200 00:11:01,640 --> 00:10:57,930 with the growth of the internet you can 201 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:01,650 find millions of articles about it but 202 00:11:06,440 --> 00:11:04,050 that is one of the oddest States and I 203 00:11:09,500 --> 00:11:06,450 think it's given birth to a lot of the 204 00:11:11,150 --> 00:11:09,510 supernatural lore over the years and so 205 00:11:13,730 --> 00:11:11,160 that seemed to be kind of a stepping 206 00:11:16,550 --> 00:11:13,740 stone for me to get into this whole idea 207 00:11:19,490 --> 00:11:16,560 of these mixed states of consciousness 208 00:11:23,750 --> 00:11:19,500 and if you don't know um sleep paralysis 209 00:11:26,310 --> 00:11:23,760 is where a person wakes up but their 210 00:11:28,140 --> 00:11:26,320 body is completely paralyzed 211 00:11:31,650 --> 00:11:28,150 they can just move their eyes and 212 00:11:34,890 --> 00:11:31,660 oftentimes what happens is they'll see a 213 00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:34,900 kind of malevolent entity that forms in 214 00:11:39,330 --> 00:11:37,330 the room and it can even come in like 215 00:11:41,700 --> 00:11:39,340 sit on their chest or attack them in 216 00:11:48,060 --> 00:11:41,710 different ways we're talking about the 217 00:11:49,680 --> 00:11:48,070 old exactly yes and different cultures 218 00:11:52,140 --> 00:11:49,690 have different names and different 219 00:11:56,370 --> 00:11:52,150 legacies about that experience it really 220 00:12:01,920 --> 00:11:56,380 goes back to antiquity Tim and I did a 221 00:12:03,900 --> 00:12:01,930 book called screwed by the aliens and we 222 00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:03,910 we talked in there about of course the 223 00:12:11,270 --> 00:12:07,890 Incubus and the coolest phenomena and 224 00:12:15,420 --> 00:12:11,280 also the the so-called the bedroom 225 00:12:18,660 --> 00:12:15,430 invaders now you've written them I think 226 00:12:21,570 --> 00:12:18,670 a chapter on the book of about this 227 00:12:24,750 --> 00:12:21,580 phenomena kid can you explain how this 228 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:24,760 ties in well like I was saying before 229 00:12:31,830 --> 00:12:28,330 about the the way sleep paralysis was 230 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:31,840 looked at in in times previous to our 231 00:12:36,900 --> 00:12:34,450 certainly was tied in with this notion 232 00:12:40,770 --> 00:12:36,910 of the succubus and the Incubus these 233 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:40,780 kind of demonic beings that would would 234 00:12:47,850 --> 00:12:44,770 attack people and often there was sort 235 00:12:49,440 --> 00:12:47,860 of a sexual component to it I speculate 236 00:12:52,050 --> 00:12:49,450 in the book that that might have been a 237 00:12:54,660 --> 00:12:52,060 factor in the whole witch persecution 238 00:12:58,020 --> 00:12:54,670 thing where they were basically accusing 239 00:13:00,810 --> 00:12:58,030 people of having Congress with with the 240 00:13:06,240 --> 00:13:00,820 devil and that could have could have 241 00:13:09,270 --> 00:13:06,250 been misinterpreted or or actually just 242 00:13:14,010 --> 00:13:09,280 these incidents of sleep paralysis that 243 00:13:15,990 --> 00:13:14,020 they even some of these figures up in 244 00:13:17,670 --> 00:13:16,000 the church that made this part of the 245 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:17,680 law of the land they might have had 246 00:13:23,220 --> 00:13:19,930 their own sleep paralysis episodes and 247 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:23,230 seemed demonic figures and decided up 248 00:13:25,830 --> 00:13:25,450 the devil's reel we got to put a stop to 249 00:13:29,670 --> 00:13:25,840 this 250 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:29,680 I was going to say he certainly seemed 251 00:13:36,270 --> 00:13:34,810 to be a horny fellow duffels there I 252 00:13:38,130 --> 00:13:36,280 think because the devil of course is 253 00:13:40,290 --> 00:13:38,140 always pictured are usually pictured 254 00:13:43,320 --> 00:13:40,300 with a horn in the tail and so forth but 255 00:13:45,840 --> 00:13:43,330 that also seems to be his mental state 256 00:13:49,460 --> 00:13:45,850 in a lot of cases as well can't keep his 257 00:13:52,590 --> 00:13:49,470 hands answers close to himself I guess 258 00:13:57,210 --> 00:13:52,600 now how about in the yep the instances 259 00:13:59,370 --> 00:13:57,220 of UFOs I John Kegel I think was the 260 00:14:02,700 --> 00:13:59,380 first the individual who brought my 261 00:14:04,790 --> 00:14:02,710 attention to the bedroom invaders and my 262 00:14:09,480 --> 00:14:04,800 friend the late Brad stager wrote about 263 00:14:12,060 --> 00:14:09,490 them as as well these alien type beings 264 00:14:13,970 --> 00:14:12,070 that are coming into people's of a 265 00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:13,980 bedroom and in some cases having 266 00:14:19,140 --> 00:14:16,330 relations with them but not not 267 00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:19,150 necessarily some of them seem to pass 268 00:14:25,380 --> 00:14:21,810 through the passing walls and ceilings 269 00:14:29,130 --> 00:14:25,390 and you know watch them over a period of 270 00:14:32,610 --> 00:14:29,140 time repeatedly I mean you know you talk 271 00:14:35,210 --> 00:14:32,620 about okay Corral sleep paralysis and 272 00:14:37,730 --> 00:14:35,220 all but it seems kind of strange 273 00:14:40,560 --> 00:14:37,740 wouldn't you say that the the same 274 00:14:44,940 --> 00:14:40,570 entities would appear time after time 275 00:14:50,310 --> 00:14:44,950 and why would they necessarily be aliens 276 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:50,320 I mean they could be witches or anything 277 00:14:54,270 --> 00:14:52,210 but people a lot of people see them 278 00:14:56,730 --> 00:14:54,280 today is aliens you think it's because 279 00:14:58,680 --> 00:14:56,740 it's been kind of implanted in their 280 00:15:01,350 --> 00:14:58,690 mind because of the TV and motion 281 00:15:04,680 --> 00:15:01,360 pictures and all I want him to take a 282 00:15:08,430 --> 00:15:04,690 look at that whole idea of our alien 283 00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:08,440 abductions simply people having sleep 284 00:15:13,140 --> 00:15:11,250 paralysis episodes there is a couple of 285 00:15:15,270 --> 00:15:13,150 psychologists that came out with that 286 00:15:17,340 --> 00:15:15,280 theory back in the 90s and we're sort of 287 00:15:20,460 --> 00:15:17,350 treating it as a real case closed 288 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:20,470 kind of thing and I actually think that 289 00:15:25,770 --> 00:15:22,810 while there are certain similarities in 290 00:15:27,660 --> 00:15:25,780 some cases might certainly be that it 291 00:15:30,030 --> 00:15:27,670 struck me that it was something 292 00:15:32,730 --> 00:15:30,040 different because as you were saying the 293 00:15:35,400 --> 00:15:32,740 the alien abduction thing in people's 294 00:15:37,470 --> 00:15:35,410 bedrooms often follows the same pattern 295 00:15:40,230 --> 00:15:37,480 over and over again with these grey 296 00:15:43,020 --> 00:15:40,240 beings looking a certain way and then 297 00:15:46,230 --> 00:15:43,030 performing these repetitive procedures 298 00:15:49,350 --> 00:15:46,240 and that to me didn't really gel with a 299 00:15:51,630 --> 00:15:49,360 lot of the accounts that I had read and 300 00:15:53,490 --> 00:15:51,640 heard about regular sleep paralysis 301 00:15:56,010 --> 00:15:53,500 because it seems 302 00:15:58,440 --> 00:15:56,020 like those are really idiosyncratic like 303 00:16:01,290 --> 00:15:58,450 one person's old hag can be completely 304 00:16:04,140 --> 00:16:01,300 different than someone else's so it's 305 00:16:06,870 --> 00:16:04,150 it's as though sleep paralysis is just 306 00:16:09,330 --> 00:16:06,880 very individualized whereas the 307 00:16:14,550 --> 00:16:09,340 alien-abduction thing seems very rote 308 00:16:18,390 --> 00:16:14,560 and repetitive and also too now some of 309 00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:18,400 these individuals who have a bedroom of 310 00:16:23,940 --> 00:16:21,010 visitors they wake up the next day and 311 00:16:26,490 --> 00:16:23,950 they may have scratches or scoop marks 312 00:16:29,100 --> 00:16:26,500 on their body and there have been some 313 00:16:31,350 --> 00:16:29,110 incidents as I'm sure you realize this 314 00:16:33,660 --> 00:16:31,360 where people supposedly have even been 315 00:16:35,490 --> 00:16:33,670 taken up out of their homes and they've 316 00:16:38,580 --> 00:16:35,500 come back wearing somebody else's 317 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:38,590 clothes or or they have you know dirt on 318 00:16:42,510 --> 00:16:40,690 their feet or something like that now I 319 00:16:44,910 --> 00:16:42,520 suppose you could explain that as a 320 00:16:49,110 --> 00:16:44,920 little bit of sleepwalking but they 321 00:16:53,820 --> 00:16:49,120 could also have had you know a real or 322 00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:53,830 non real in a sense experience yeah it's 323 00:16:59,880 --> 00:16:56,410 it's really hard to say for sure what is 324 00:17:02,250 --> 00:16:59,890 going on with with those episodes I I 325 00:17:05,640 --> 00:17:02,260 guess if I had to take a guess that if 326 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:05,650 people are being abducted and taken onto 327 00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:08,770 ships that it's most likely occurring in 328 00:17:13,470 --> 00:17:11,170 this kind of other-dimensional way where 329 00:17:15,630 --> 00:17:13,480 their their body perhapses and isn't 330 00:17:19,429 --> 00:17:15,640 leaving the room but their consciousness 331 00:17:23,910 --> 00:17:19,439 or experiences going somewhere else 332 00:17:26,699 --> 00:17:23,920 now up on the the show of course close 333 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:26,709 Betty Hills niece has been on numerous 334 00:17:33,690 --> 00:17:29,050 of times and she's been our our program 335 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:33,700 as well and the intriguing of the course 336 00:17:39,690 --> 00:17:36,970 of the incident as far as dreams go in 337 00:17:43,110 --> 00:17:39,700 the Betty and Barney Hill incident is 338 00:17:46,890 --> 00:17:43,120 that according to some people Betty and 339 00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:46,900 Barney actually shared dreams that's why 340 00:17:51,240 --> 00:17:48,730 you know the experience was a real one 341 00:17:53,340 --> 00:17:51,250 of them was I guess they hysterical 342 00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:53,350 because they saw this unexplained object 343 00:17:58,980 --> 00:17:54,970 in the sky or light or something well it 344 00:18:01,320 --> 00:17:58,990 was a real UFO or something else they 345 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:01,330 had nightmares about it and their mate 346 00:18:06,460 --> 00:18:03,610 worth picking up this nightmare in their 347 00:18:08,649 --> 00:18:06,470 dreams is that possible 348 00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:08,659 the shared dream phenomenon is extremely 349 00:18:16,869 --> 00:18:11,570 rare so I would bet against that 350 00:18:18,700 --> 00:18:16,879 explanation certainly nightmares and and 351 00:18:21,220 --> 00:18:18,710 different kinds of dreams have an 352 00:18:23,560 --> 00:18:21,230 association with UFO sightings and 353 00:18:26,680 --> 00:18:23,570 encounters so it becomes kind of a murky 354 00:18:29,619 --> 00:18:26,690 territory to sift through it all because 355 00:18:31,810 --> 00:18:29,629 a lot of times people that claim to have 356 00:18:34,960 --> 00:18:31,820 been abducted then will have nightmares 357 00:18:37,659 --> 00:18:34,970 later on and that would make sense in 358 00:18:41,049 --> 00:18:37,669 that a lot of nightmares are associated 359 00:18:43,930 --> 00:18:41,059 with traumas and the body or the psyche 360 00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:43,940 trying to resolve it in some way or get 361 00:18:52,749 --> 00:18:49,250 past it now did you find in your 362 00:18:55,259 --> 00:18:52,759 research that any a prominent to 363 00:19:00,389 --> 00:18:55,269 scientists or researchers are doing 364 00:19:03,460 --> 00:19:00,399 examining any of this data certainly 365 00:19:06,730 --> 00:19:03,470 something like lucid dreaming has has 366 00:19:09,279 --> 00:19:06,740 been scientifically studied going back a 367 00:19:10,779 --> 00:19:09,289 few decades now with Stephen Laberge and 368 00:19:14,499 --> 00:19:10,789 a few other people kind of kicking 369 00:19:16,509 --> 00:19:14,509 kicking that off with kind of like the 370 00:19:21,159 --> 00:19:16,519 crypto research you were referencing 371 00:19:23,980 --> 00:19:21,169 from decades even earlier but so that is 372 00:19:26,169 --> 00:19:23,990 something that lucid dreaming was 373 00:19:33,789 --> 00:19:26,179 formerly thought to to not even really 374 00:19:37,180 --> 00:19:33,799 be a real thing by explain sure lucid 375 00:19:40,419 --> 00:19:37,190 dreaming is recognizing that you're in a 376 00:19:42,850 --> 00:19:40,429 dream while you're having the dream so 377 00:19:45,190 --> 00:19:42,860 instead of kind of falling for whatever 378 00:19:46,810 --> 00:19:45,200 the dream narrative is and your place 379 00:19:48,940 --> 00:19:46,820 tune in it and you're being kind of 380 00:19:51,190 --> 00:19:48,950 swept along in the story you kind of 381 00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:51,200 take a step back and go oh wait a minute 382 00:19:58,060 --> 00:19:55,250 this is actually a dream and that can be 383 00:19:59,919 --> 00:19:58,070 very empowering and opened the doors to 384 00:20:03,310 --> 00:19:59,929 a lot of different possibilities that 385 00:20:05,200 --> 00:20:03,320 people can experience and some of it 386 00:20:08,649 --> 00:20:05,210 does border into these strange 387 00:20:10,869 --> 00:20:08,659 paranormal or spiritual mystical kinds 388 00:20:15,009 --> 00:20:10,879 of states I don't have you the two of 389 00:20:18,970 --> 00:20:15,019 you had experiences with lucidity well 390 00:20:19,910 --> 00:20:18,980 you know I've had III guess I would 391 00:20:21,470 --> 00:20:19,920 consider the more 392 00:20:23,360 --> 00:20:21,480 nightmares or something where I'm being 393 00:20:25,460 --> 00:20:23,370 chased by somebody saving the night for 394 00:20:26,990 --> 00:20:25,470 something and I realized that I'm in a 395 00:20:27,530 --> 00:20:27,000 dream and I'm trying to get out of a 396 00:20:29,810 --> 00:20:27,540 dream 397 00:20:33,380 --> 00:20:29,820 and then something that occurs outside 398 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:33,390 of the dream gets me out of the 399 00:20:40,970 --> 00:20:37,290 situation that I'm in somehow it's hard 400 00:20:43,970 --> 00:20:40,980 to explain but somehow an incident will 401 00:20:46,340 --> 00:20:43,980 happen like a car door slamming outside 402 00:20:48,770 --> 00:20:46,350 but it will be part it will be part of 403 00:20:51,470 --> 00:20:48,780 the dream which I don't know how that's 404 00:20:54,830 --> 00:20:51,480 necessarily possible because it builds 405 00:21:00,640 --> 00:20:54,840 up to happening so it's like you know 406 00:21:07,780 --> 00:21:03,860 yeah there's a lot of odd blendings that 407 00:21:10,940 --> 00:21:07,790 happen between these kind of waking 408 00:21:12,700 --> 00:21:10,950 sensations and going into the dream 409 00:21:15,850 --> 00:21:12,710 state I look at what are called 410 00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:15,860 parasomnias early in depth and those are 411 00:21:21,740 --> 00:21:19,250 unusual physical or emotional 412 00:21:25,460 --> 00:21:21,750 occurrences that accompany sleep and 413 00:21:28,820 --> 00:21:25,470 dreams and there's one condition called 414 00:21:30,740 --> 00:21:28,830 REM behavior disorder and that is kind 415 00:21:33,890 --> 00:21:30,750 of like a funhouse mirror of sleep 416 00:21:35,990 --> 00:21:33,900 paralysis so instead of being paralyzed 417 00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:36,000 while you're while you're dreaming which 418 00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:40,050 is the normal REM you're paralyzed so 419 00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:41,730 you don't move around and that's thought 420 00:21:46,990 --> 00:21:44,610 to be the bleed-over effect during sleep 421 00:21:49,700 --> 00:21:47,000 paralysis but in this other condition 422 00:21:51,650 --> 00:21:49,710 people are not paralyzed while they're 423 00:21:54,230 --> 00:21:51,660 dreaming so they're dreaming and they're 424 00:21:56,990 --> 00:21:54,240 moving around and this one case are 425 00:21:59,810 --> 00:21:57,000 right about a man thought that he was 426 00:22:01,610 --> 00:21:59,820 trying to get this skunk out of his tent 427 00:22:04,100 --> 00:22:01,620 and he was just kind of savagely 428 00:22:06,530 --> 00:22:04,110 attacking the skunk and trying to pull 429 00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:06,540 it out of the tent and it turns out in 430 00:22:11,990 --> 00:22:09,210 in actuality he was pulling on his 431 00:22:14,090 --> 00:22:12,000 wife's long hair who was sleeping next 432 00:22:17,090 --> 00:22:14,100 to him and she was you know kind of 433 00:22:21,020 --> 00:22:17,100 trying to fend him off so it it raises 434 00:22:23,930 --> 00:22:21,030 the interesting issue of these sensory 435 00:22:26,090 --> 00:22:23,940 data like somehow her long hair was 436 00:22:30,950 --> 00:22:26,100 being interpreted as the skunk in the 437 00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:30,960 dream state well you know a couple of 438 00:22:36,500 --> 00:22:33,810 times I had the experience where 439 00:22:38,630 --> 00:22:36,510 somebody would write me a letter for 440 00:22:40,730 --> 00:22:38,640 today's the Internet and I would read 441 00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:40,740 the fall asleep while reading the letter 442 00:22:47,090 --> 00:22:45,090 and then I would find myself in there in 443 00:22:49,610 --> 00:22:47,100 their apartment and the next day I would 444 00:22:51,980 --> 00:22:49,620 describe to them what I saw and 445 00:22:54,860 --> 00:22:51,990 apparently it was it was a fairly 446 00:22:57,860 --> 00:22:54,870 accurate in fact it was one gal who 447 00:23:00,110 --> 00:22:57,870 worked for a rather famous of rock and 448 00:23:03,620 --> 00:23:00,120 roll a promoter of the reasons I got 449 00:23:05,360 --> 00:23:03,630 page because I helped her find a a ring 450 00:23:07,610 --> 00:23:05,370 that had gone missing she actually had 451 00:23:10,310 --> 00:23:07,620 written me a two-page letter about how 452 00:23:12,370 --> 00:23:10,320 this ring was very important to her and 453 00:23:15,380 --> 00:23:12,380 I read the letter and I fell asleep and 454 00:23:17,990 --> 00:23:15,390 I saw where it was behind the bureau and 455 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:18,000 I called it the next day and told her 456 00:23:21,890 --> 00:23:19,530 what I had seen and apparently according 457 00:23:26,090 --> 00:23:21,900 to her I was well here I was dead on 458 00:23:28,610 --> 00:23:26,100 accurate right and I Pam we have to we 459 00:23:30,260 --> 00:23:28,620 have to write down for a second and go 460 00:23:31,750 --> 00:23:30,270 to our break we'll be right back for 461 00:23:40,310 --> 00:23:31,760 more exploring observe 462 00:23:47,040 --> 00:23:44,490 now back to exploring the bazaars with 463 00:23:50,370 --> 00:23:47,050 two of the most electrifying researchers 464 00:23:55,290 --> 00:23:50,380 in the Paranoid your hosts Timothy Becca 465 00:23:57,000 --> 00:23:55,300 Lee Anton's was walking back to 466 00:24:00,840 --> 00:23:57,010 exploring the bazaar I'm Tim Schwartz 467 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:00,850 tonight our guest is Lex lone hood Nova 468 00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:05,170 and we are discussing his book nightmare 469 00:24:12,150 --> 00:24:08,290 land travels at the borders of sleep 470 00:24:15,299 --> 00:24:12,160 dreams and wakefulness so Lex I suppose 471 00:24:18,390 --> 00:24:15,309 the big question you're talking in the 472 00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:18,400 first segment about especially about 473 00:24:24,630 --> 00:24:21,850 dreams and some of the other mysteries 474 00:24:27,090 --> 00:24:24,640 of sleep but the mystery the biggest 475 00:24:30,900 --> 00:24:27,100 mystery I think is just what exactly is 476 00:24:34,169 --> 00:24:30,910 sleep it certainly is a mysterious state 477 00:24:36,810 --> 00:24:34,179 I think that it's fairly new science to 478 00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:36,820 where we're just learning kind of as we 479 00:24:43,169 --> 00:24:40,690 go I think in terms of what has been 480 00:24:45,770 --> 00:24:43,179 discovered about the sleep state is that 481 00:24:48,810 --> 00:24:45,780 it is performing a lot of needed 482 00:24:51,630 --> 00:24:48,820 physiological functions and detoxifying 483 00:24:53,669 --> 00:24:51,640 and I mean as everybody knows when 484 00:24:55,980 --> 00:24:53,679 you're sleep deprived you don't feel 485 00:24:58,980 --> 00:24:55,990 like your normal self so I think clearly 486 00:25:01,020 --> 00:24:58,990 there's some benefits going on from 487 00:25:04,230 --> 00:25:01,030 sleep but I think dreams are more 488 00:25:06,120 --> 00:25:04,240 mysterious in kind of the post freud era 489 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:06,130 there's a lot of different competing 490 00:25:13,049 --> 00:25:08,650 theories as to what the purpose of them 491 00:25:16,470 --> 00:25:13,059 really is and i've not found one theory 492 00:25:18,570 --> 00:25:16,480 that seems to fit fit all instances so i 493 00:25:22,049 --> 00:25:18,580 think that that's something that is 494 00:25:25,700 --> 00:25:22,059 still a genuine mystery now you brought 495 00:25:31,710 --> 00:25:25,710 up a good point about sleep deprivation 496 00:25:35,790 --> 00:25:31,720 that has been used for centuries as as a 497 00:25:37,799 --> 00:25:35,800 form of torture yeah absolutely yeah it 498 00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:37,809 was kind of perfected in the Middle Ages 499 00:25:44,780 --> 00:25:41,290 and they used it against suspected 500 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:44,790 witches and then in in the 20th century 501 00:25:51,360 --> 00:25:48,250 no Stalinist gulags they they 502 00:25:54,540 --> 00:25:51,370 I went to town with using that as a way 503 00:25:58,590 --> 00:25:54,550 to torture people without them having 504 00:26:00,500 --> 00:25:58,600 any physical signs of harm and what some 505 00:26:03,750 --> 00:26:00,510 of the people said about that was it was 506 00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:03,760 they would sign anything do anything it 507 00:26:09,060 --> 00:26:07,090 was a bigger Drive than then eating or 508 00:26:11,010 --> 00:26:09,070 anything in their life if they could 509 00:26:13,890 --> 00:26:11,020 just get some sleep I think would agree 510 00:26:17,940 --> 00:26:13,900 to whatever they want say whatever they 511 00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:17,950 they needed them to say well there's and 512 00:26:22,860 --> 00:26:19,410 there's been people who have 513 00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:22,870 deliberately tried to keep themselves 514 00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:26,530 awake you know marathons or things like 515 00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:29,530 that and and it seems like that after 516 00:26:35,670 --> 00:26:34,090 you reach a certain point yeah I'm like 517 00:26:37,410 --> 00:26:35,680 you know eating or even you know 518 00:26:39,300 --> 00:26:37,420 drinking water or anything like that 519 00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:39,310 it's just that sleep just becomes 520 00:26:46,740 --> 00:26:43,930 inevitable yeah I mean it was done as a 521 00:26:48,570 --> 00:26:46,750 stunt by DJ's and different things like 522 00:26:50,940 --> 00:26:48,580 that some of them too against that it 523 00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:50,950 means to stay away but they would often 524 00:26:58,070 --> 00:26:53,610 lapse into these kind of living 525 00:27:00,450 --> 00:26:58,080 hallucinatory periods that in one case 526 00:27:04,260 --> 00:27:00,460 psychiatrists that was kind of shadowing 527 00:27:06,690 --> 00:27:04,270 the DJ that was doing this heath he 528 00:27:08,940 --> 00:27:06,700 noticed that the hallucinations seemed 529 00:27:12,060 --> 00:27:08,950 to mirror when the person would be 530 00:27:15,330 --> 00:27:12,070 having their REM dream stayed because 531 00:27:17,460 --> 00:27:15,340 you dream and a different set of cycles 532 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:17,470 each time you dream you start off in 533 00:27:23,220 --> 00:27:20,650 non-rem or deep sleep and go through 534 00:27:26,310 --> 00:27:23,230 several stages of that and then go into 535 00:27:29,370 --> 00:27:26,320 REM so these waking hallucinations were 536 00:27:32,750 --> 00:27:29,380 occurring like every you know 45 or 90 537 00:27:35,790 --> 00:27:32,760 minutes or so but but this idea of 538 00:27:38,070 --> 00:27:35,800 staying awake I think was taken to a 539 00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:38,080 really interesting degree by this 540 00:27:43,740 --> 00:27:40,690 British consciousness researcher named 541 00:27:48,210 --> 00:27:43,750 Tony Wright who came up with a theory 542 00:27:50,730 --> 00:27:48,220 that by using sleep deprivation and 543 00:27:57,270 --> 00:27:50,740 staying awake it would cause the 544 00:28:00,030 --> 00:27:57,280 normally dominant right hemisphere to or 545 00:28:01,810 --> 00:28:00,040 the left hemisphere to become - that 546 00:28:04,870 --> 00:28:01,820 would fall asleep and then the right 547 00:28:07,330 --> 00:28:04,880 side which is normally quiet would be 548 00:28:10,270 --> 00:28:07,340 able to have more dominance and that's 549 00:28:12,460 --> 00:28:10,280 aside that's connected with feeling and 550 00:28:15,280 --> 00:28:12,470 intuition in his case you would have 551 00:28:17,470 --> 00:28:15,290 these deeply profound religious 552 00:28:19,860 --> 00:28:17,480 experiences while while in this 553 00:28:22,840 --> 00:28:19,870 condition of extreme sleep deprivation 554 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:22,850 so that's kind of interesting to 555 00:28:31,870 --> 00:28:27,530 consider we've got a question from Jeff 556 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:31,880 from a chat room and Jeff asked Lex have 557 00:28:34,510 --> 00:28:33,170 you ever heard of people who normally 558 00:28:36,460 --> 00:28:34,520 sleep on their back and under the sheets 559 00:28:38,170 --> 00:28:36,470 suddenly waking up in the middle of the 560 00:28:40,930 --> 00:28:38,180 night on top of the sheets on their 561 00:28:43,180 --> 00:28:40,940 belly and backwards with their head at 562 00:28:46,510 --> 00:28:43,190 the foot of the bed and not knowing how 563 00:28:50,020 --> 00:28:46,520 they flipped around like that and I know 564 00:28:53,170 --> 00:28:50,030 that I've seen people who just go 565 00:28:56,190 --> 00:28:53,180 through all types of of contortions when 566 00:28:57,820 --> 00:28:56,200 there's asleep I mean when you're asleep 567 00:29:01,030 --> 00:28:57,830 you're just not 568 00:29:03,550 --> 00:29:01,040 one permanent position you know most 569 00:29:05,980 --> 00:29:03,560 people tend to move around quite a bit 570 00:29:07,810 --> 00:29:05,990 yeah I think you you've got it right 571 00:29:09,850 --> 00:29:07,820 there right I know that sometimes my 572 00:29:12,040 --> 00:29:09,860 body will start moving diagonally 573 00:29:13,510 --> 00:29:12,050 it's an odd sensation though you almost 574 00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:13,520 feel like it is something on a 575 00:29:19,870 --> 00:29:16,370 paranormal activity like who is moving 576 00:29:22,270 --> 00:29:19,880 my body but in terms of sleeping on your 577 00:29:25,390 --> 00:29:22,280 back that is one of the things that's 578 00:29:27,190 --> 00:29:25,400 associated with sleep paralysis so for 579 00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:27,200 people that are plagued with that as a 580 00:29:32,170 --> 00:29:29,330 problem one of the kind of 581 00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:32,180 do-it-yourself solutions is you can sew 582 00:29:39,250 --> 00:29:35,930 a tennis ball into the back of a pajama 583 00:29:40,750 --> 00:29:39,260 top or t-shirt and that because 584 00:29:43,390 --> 00:29:40,760 sometimes if you start sleeping on your 585 00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:43,400 side you'll turn over onto your back and 586 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:45,770 if you've got this tennis ball there 587 00:29:53,380 --> 00:29:48,410 that'll keep you from from ever sleeping 588 00:29:57,550 --> 00:29:53,390 on your back out like the pea under the 589 00:30:01,120 --> 00:29:57,560 mattress type tennis ball under the 590 00:30:02,830 --> 00:30:01,130 mattress when we were talking about a 591 00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:02,840 sleep deprivation you know you're 592 00:30:11,380 --> 00:30:06,770 talking about how the the psychologist 593 00:30:15,490 --> 00:30:11,390 had noticed how when a person was awake 594 00:30:21,639 --> 00:30:15,500 the the cycles of hallucinations and 595 00:30:27,610 --> 00:30:21,649 based on some of my dreaming experiences 596 00:30:29,950 --> 00:30:27,620 I've I've often wondered whether we are 597 00:30:32,019 --> 00:30:29,960 not even even while we're awake there's 598 00:30:35,139 --> 00:30:32,029 a part of our brain that is always 599 00:30:38,139 --> 00:30:35,149 dreaming and and then when you fall 600 00:30:39,549 --> 00:30:38,149 asleep it just kind of like it breaks 601 00:30:41,860 --> 00:30:39,559 through you know it gets past 602 00:30:45,580 --> 00:30:41,870 consciousness and yeah and then just you 603 00:30:48,700 --> 00:30:45,590 know overwhelms your brain there's been 604 00:30:51,129 --> 00:30:48,710 times where I've started to go to sleep 605 00:30:53,379 --> 00:30:51,139 and then you know the noise would happen 606 00:30:56,110 --> 00:30:53,389 and I would wake up but it would seem 607 00:30:59,379 --> 00:30:56,120 like just almost as soon as I would 608 00:31:01,269 --> 00:30:59,389 start to close my eye the dreams would 609 00:31:02,710 --> 00:31:01,279 just take over and sometimes it would be 610 00:31:04,570 --> 00:31:02,720 like just right in the middle of a story 611 00:31:08,110 --> 00:31:04,580 which you know just you know maybe 612 00:31:11,249 --> 00:31:08,120 wonder whether or not the dreams are 613 00:31:14,470 --> 00:31:11,259 just constantly going on in your head 614 00:31:17,399 --> 00:31:14,480 yeah I ran across that as something 615 00:31:20,980 --> 00:31:17,409 proposed by some different consciousness 616 00:31:23,379 --> 00:31:20,990 researchers and mystical gurus and I 617 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:23,389 think there's some validity to that kind 618 00:31:28,149 --> 00:31:25,850 of this idea that the Dreaming state is 619 00:31:30,759 --> 00:31:28,159 it's like a radio broadcast that's going 620 00:31:33,340 --> 00:31:30,769 on all the time but we were not really 621 00:31:35,740 --> 00:31:33,350 aware of it when we're perceiving our 622 00:31:38,769 --> 00:31:35,750 six senses and going about our waking 623 00:31:42,430 --> 00:31:38,779 life so I think that that could could 624 00:31:44,649 --> 00:31:42,440 actually be be true and certainly when 625 00:31:48,039 --> 00:31:44,659 you fall into this mid kind of half 626 00:31:50,289 --> 00:31:48,049 sleeps take the hypnagogic state you get 627 00:31:54,580 --> 00:31:50,299 these little dream lights and and kind 628 00:31:57,610 --> 00:31:54,590 of odd visions so that's kind of a 629 00:31:59,230 --> 00:31:57,620 doorway and into that and of course 630 00:32:02,049 --> 00:31:59,240 there there has also been the 631 00:32:04,509 --> 00:32:02,059 suggestions that that your dreams maybe 632 00:32:10,180 --> 00:32:04,519 not all of them but but some of them are 633 00:32:13,960 --> 00:32:10,190 actual actually experiences that you are 634 00:32:15,669 --> 00:32:13,970 going through in alternative realities 635 00:32:17,230 --> 00:32:15,679 that you know whatever it is your 636 00:32:18,430 --> 00:32:17,240 consciousness that you know makes you 637 00:32:20,980 --> 00:32:18,440 you 638 00:32:23,799 --> 00:32:20,990 extends across an infinite number of 639 00:32:26,190 --> 00:32:23,809 worlds and that when you fall asleep you 640 00:32:29,140 --> 00:32:26,200 know that it 641 00:32:32,350 --> 00:32:29,150 that Center on this reality breaks down 642 00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:32,360 a bit and you start experiencing the the 643 00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:34,610 other realities that are close to us 644 00:32:39,880 --> 00:32:37,010 that's why some of the some of our 645 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:39,890 dreams and you can tell the difference 646 00:32:45,580 --> 00:32:42,650 some dreams you have are highly 647 00:32:48,670 --> 00:32:45,590 emotional and you know people in those 648 00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:48,680 dreams that you don't know in your in 649 00:32:53,080 --> 00:32:50,210 your waking life and when you wake up 650 00:32:56,410 --> 00:32:53,090 sometimes you actually have this this 651 00:32:57,970 --> 00:32:56,420 sense of profound loss that you're not 652 00:33:02,560 --> 00:32:57,980 going to be with that that person again 653 00:33:05,770 --> 00:33:02,570 at least not currently yeah there are 654 00:33:08,170 --> 00:33:05,780 cases where people seem to visit a whole 655 00:33:11,050 --> 00:33:08,180 different existence in the dream state I 656 00:33:13,600 --> 00:33:11,060 know there was one case ironic I ran 657 00:33:16,810 --> 00:33:13,610 across in the lucid dreaming research of 658 00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:16,820 someone who would experience like years 659 00:33:22,270 --> 00:33:19,730 in just one night in the dream state so 660 00:33:24,550 --> 00:33:22,280 to the extent he was experiencing this 661 00:33:26,890 --> 00:33:24,560 life in this other realm I think it was 662 00:33:29,380 --> 00:33:26,900 like in the far future and he would 663 00:33:33,580 --> 00:33:29,390 actually go to sleep in this life and 664 00:33:35,620 --> 00:33:33,590 have dreams within this lucid dream so 665 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:35,630 that the you know it starts to become 666 00:33:40,060 --> 00:33:38,210 kind of a fascinating Hall of Mirrors 667 00:33:42,310 --> 00:33:40,070 when you start getting into that 668 00:33:48,730 --> 00:33:42,320 territory it's like a it's like a 669 00:33:51,430 --> 00:33:48,740 Phillip K dick story very much so now go 670 00:33:54,910 --> 00:33:51,440 ahead - no no I just say he's written 671 00:33:56,950 --> 00:33:54,920 you know about that no I you know I I'm 672 00:34:00,370 --> 00:33:56,960 wondering we talked about sleepwalking 673 00:34:02,140 --> 00:34:00,380 and all but can you take it even further 674 00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:02,150 than just walking in your sleep I mean 675 00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:04,130 have people committed crimes or done 676 00:34:10,450 --> 00:34:06,170 things that they they claimed they were 677 00:34:13,050 --> 00:34:10,460 not we're aware of oh absolutely yeah I 678 00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:13,060 have a whole chapter on sleep murders 679 00:34:19,750 --> 00:34:16,850 getting into this true crime territory 680 00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:19,760 and certainly with these kind of cases 681 00:34:25,450 --> 00:34:23,090 you you're left wondering okay is this 682 00:34:29,970 --> 00:34:25,460 just an you know a Twinkie defense kind 683 00:34:33,100 --> 00:34:29,980 of thing or are people able to actually 684 00:34:35,740 --> 00:34:33,110 commit these heinous actions and not 685 00:34:38,050 --> 00:34:35,750 really be consciously aware that they're 686 00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:38,060 doing it one of the most famous cases 687 00:34:41,950 --> 00:34:39,290 was in 688 00:34:45,669 --> 00:34:41,960 with a fellow named Kenneth parks who 689 00:34:49,740 --> 00:34:45,679 allegedly drove 14 miles to his in-laws 690 00:34:52,270 --> 00:34:49,750 house while asleep and then proceeded to 691 00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:52,280 stab one of them to death 692 00:35:00,280 --> 00:34:57,170 ouch but he was known as a sleepwalker 693 00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:00,290 with a lot of odd sleep abnormalities 694 00:35:05,550 --> 00:35:02,690 and they were able to show that on this 695 00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:05,560 machine called a polysomnogram that 696 00:35:12,040 --> 00:35:08,090 gives kind of readings of brain waves 697 00:35:14,500 --> 00:35:12,050 while while people are sleeping so did 698 00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:14,510 he get away with murder he actually did 699 00:35:19,990 --> 00:35:17,930 I went the case ended up going to the 700 00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:20,000 Canadian Supreme Court because they were 701 00:35:24,670 --> 00:35:22,970 a lot of people were just sort of 702 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:24,680 shocked by the whole thing and the 703 00:35:31,230 --> 00:35:27,490 Supreme Court backed the original 704 00:35:34,210 --> 00:35:31,240 decision and and he did get off I think 705 00:35:37,420 --> 00:35:34,220 it does raise the question of this whole 706 00:35:41,980 --> 00:35:37,430 idea of how does the Judas judicial 707 00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:41,990 system evaluate these cases of when 708 00:35:46,690 --> 00:35:44,090 someone is not fully conscious and 709 00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:46,700 certainly with ambien and some of these 710 00:35:53,470 --> 00:35:49,130 other drugs you get into these very gray 711 00:35:55,530 --> 00:35:53,480 areas where how how much is a person 712 00:35:58,600 --> 00:35:55,540 responsible can they just blame the 713 00:36:00,940 --> 00:35:58,610 pharmaceutical company for they get in 714 00:36:02,190 --> 00:36:00,950 their car and get into an accident and 715 00:36:04,990 --> 00:36:02,200 hurt someone 716 00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:05,000 initially they they kind of could but 717 00:36:09,940 --> 00:36:07,010 then as the side effects of some of 718 00:36:12,220 --> 00:36:09,950 drugs like that became known then it was 719 00:36:17,770 --> 00:36:12,230 considered more the responsibility of 720 00:36:21,820 --> 00:36:17,780 the person taking the medication now 721 00:36:24,820 --> 00:36:21,830 Brian on skype wants to know dreaming 722 00:36:28,300 --> 00:36:24,830 and or astral traveling are they one of 723 00:36:31,360 --> 00:36:28,310 the same or different and if you if you 724 00:36:32,530 --> 00:36:31,370 can answer that one Lex I there's a lot 725 00:36:35,170 --> 00:36:32,540 of people who have written books over 726 00:36:38,980 --> 00:36:35,180 the years that would really love to hear 727 00:36:41,710 --> 00:36:38,990 that one well I do think there's a kind 728 00:36:44,860 --> 00:36:41,720 of multi-dimensional aspect to dreams 729 00:36:48,610 --> 00:36:44,870 where often I feel like right when I 730 00:36:52,549 --> 00:36:48,620 wake up I can't translate or bring that 731 00:36:55,429 --> 00:36:52,559 that reality back into my waking world 732 00:36:57,679 --> 00:36:55,439 so it does strike me that on a fair a 733 00:37:00,589 --> 00:36:57,689 fair amount of frequency what I'm 734 00:37:03,949 --> 00:37:00,599 experiencing doesn't seem to gel with 735 00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:03,959 with our own version of reality so in 736 00:37:09,469 --> 00:37:07,170 that sense I guess it becomes kind of a 737 00:37:11,509 --> 00:37:09,479 terminology thing like what what is the 738 00:37:14,509 --> 00:37:11,519 astral plane or the astral world and 739 00:37:16,579 --> 00:37:14,519 certainly that is something that people 740 00:37:19,999 --> 00:37:16,589 have wondered about you know where where 741 00:37:22,459 --> 00:37:20,009 are these experiences taking place so 742 00:37:24,739 --> 00:37:22,469 yeah it's hard hard to say for certain 743 00:37:26,900 --> 00:37:24,749 but it does seem like we're having some 744 00:37:29,929 --> 00:37:26,910 kind of expanded consciousness or 745 00:37:32,620 --> 00:37:29,939 reality in the dream state and I know 746 00:37:36,469 --> 00:37:32,630 that some applicants for lucid dreaming 747 00:37:40,849 --> 00:37:36,479 say that if you learn to control your 748 00:37:44,749 --> 00:37:40,859 dreams that that this is a method that 749 00:37:47,660 --> 00:37:44,759 you can then learn to astral project you 750 00:37:50,239 --> 00:37:47,670 know in your sleep I think the the late 751 00:37:54,319 --> 00:37:50,249 Robert Monroe was one of the ones who 752 00:37:59,419 --> 00:37:54,329 who talked about that initially but now 753 00:38:01,099 --> 00:37:59,429 a quarry wants to know that there was an 754 00:38:02,630 --> 00:38:01,109 old and and you know why I remember 755 00:38:05,419 --> 00:38:02,640 hearing this and when I was a kid that 756 00:38:08,749 --> 00:38:05,429 if you die in your sleep you will die in 757 00:38:10,370 --> 00:38:08,759 real life and and I suppose that anybody 758 00:38:13,900 --> 00:38:10,380 who's had that happen if it's true 759 00:38:18,789 --> 00:38:13,910 they're not here to confirm it or not 760 00:38:22,249 --> 00:38:18,799 well a it is I think that as you say we 761 00:38:24,499 --> 00:38:22,259 we can't say for certain D but I think 762 00:38:27,229 --> 00:38:24,509 many people have had experiences of 763 00:38:30,410 --> 00:38:27,239 dying and they've come back to to tell 764 00:38:32,089 --> 00:38:30,420 about it in the dream state but in terms 765 00:38:34,699 --> 00:38:32,099 of like a nightmarish kind of thing 766 00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:34,709 usually I think people do wake up right 767 00:38:41,150 --> 00:38:38,249 before they die or get shot or something 768 00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:41,160 that's super traumatic like that I do 769 00:38:46,130 --> 00:38:43,650 write about this bizarre syndrome called 770 00:38:49,549 --> 00:38:46,140 sudden unexplained nocturnal death 771 00:38:53,150 --> 00:38:49,559 syndrome which occurred back in the 772 00:38:55,009 --> 00:38:53,160 1980s to a group of Southeast Asian 773 00:38:57,890 --> 00:38:55,019 immigrants it was actually the 774 00:38:59,929 --> 00:38:57,900 inspiration for Wes Craven for his 775 00:39:02,479 --> 00:38:59,939 Freddy Krueger character in Nightmare on 776 00:39:06,440 --> 00:39:02,489 Elm Street because this particular group 777 00:39:09,140 --> 00:39:06,450 was having these basically sleeper al 778 00:39:12,710 --> 00:39:09,150 episodes that were so frightening to 779 00:39:14,539 --> 00:39:12,720 them that they they were found basically 780 00:39:17,690 --> 00:39:14,549 dying of heart attacks just with these 781 00:39:23,150 --> 00:39:17,700 kind of stricken facial expressions 782 00:39:25,670 --> 00:39:23,160 laying stiff in bed and a researcher 783 00:39:29,210 --> 00:39:25,680 went back a couple decades later Shelley 784 00:39:31,430 --> 00:39:29,220 Adler and did some had some very 785 00:39:34,970 --> 00:39:31,440 interesting findings about it because 786 00:39:38,210 --> 00:39:34,980 what was going on was that in this 787 00:39:40,370 --> 00:39:38,220 particular culture they believed that if 788 00:39:42,740 --> 00:39:40,380 they fell away from the old traditions 789 00:39:44,809 --> 00:39:42,750 which in in their case of the religion 790 00:39:46,910 --> 00:39:44,819 involved things like animal sacrifice 791 00:39:49,130 --> 00:39:46,920 which they kind of stopped doing and 792 00:39:52,000 --> 00:39:49,140 when they moved to the US that they 793 00:39:55,130 --> 00:39:52,010 could face retribution from these demons 794 00:39:58,430 --> 00:39:55,140 associated with sleep paralysis and so 795 00:40:00,349 --> 00:39:58,440 they believed that once the demon showed 796 00:40:03,079 --> 00:40:00,359 up it was going to keep coming back 797 00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:03,089 until they died and so she called it the 798 00:40:08,870 --> 00:40:05,490 nocebo effect kind of like the dark 799 00:40:11,720 --> 00:40:08,880 cousin of the placebo effect and then 800 00:40:15,799 --> 00:40:11,730 further they excuse me 801 00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:15,809 they found out that a lot of these men 802 00:40:21,859 --> 00:40:18,930 had this rare heart condition that was 803 00:40:24,190 --> 00:40:21,869 hidden that so that they would otherwise 804 00:40:27,440 --> 00:40:24,200 appear healthy it was kind of a a 805 00:40:29,930 --> 00:40:27,450 genetic disorder and so that in the 806 00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:29,940 combination with the nocebo was what was 807 00:40:39,950 --> 00:40:37,170 doing them in no-no-no 808 00:40:42,289 --> 00:40:39,960 well I was just I was just going to say 809 00:40:45,170 --> 00:40:42,299 now are there are there cases where 810 00:40:47,150 --> 00:40:45,180 people can actually we talked about you 811 00:40:49,579 --> 00:40:47,160 know Freddy Krueger you know are there 812 00:40:52,549 --> 00:40:49,589 cases where people have actually able to 813 00:40:55,549 --> 00:40:52,559 get into our dream and and manipulate us 814 00:41:00,319 --> 00:40:55,559 and perhaps through something negative 815 00:41:02,059 --> 00:41:00,329 or evil trying to take possession yeah 816 00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:02,069 it's certainly interesting to ponder I 817 00:41:08,240 --> 00:41:04,770 have a chapter on psychic attacks or I 818 00:41:11,289 --> 00:41:08,250 look at that very issue and I do think 819 00:41:14,539 --> 00:41:11,299 it's possible both by so-called 820 00:41:17,319 --> 00:41:14,549 sorcerers living people that perfect the 821 00:41:20,180 --> 00:41:17,329 ability to kind of dream walking into 822 00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:20,190 people's people's dreams 823 00:41:24,349 --> 00:41:22,290 could create kind of the mother of all 824 00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:24,359 nightmares and then scoot out of there 825 00:41:28,849 --> 00:41:26,490 and the person wouldn't would still be 826 00:41:30,410 --> 00:41:28,859 stuck having even if they saw that other 827 00:41:34,640 --> 00:41:30,420 person there they would kind of know 828 00:41:37,910 --> 00:41:34,650 well it was just a dream so but in terms 829 00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:37,920 of discarnate entities and all sorts of 830 00:41:43,970 --> 00:41:41,010 astral beings this could actually be a 831 00:41:46,609 --> 00:41:43,980 way that they are able to access our 832 00:41:50,329 --> 00:41:46,619 consciousness I got particularly 833 00:41:52,450 --> 00:41:50,339 interested in this non REM sleep state 834 00:41:55,099 --> 00:41:52,460 or the the deep waves slow wave sleep 835 00:41:57,020 --> 00:41:55,109 where because I originally thought okay 836 00:41:59,390 --> 00:41:57,030 there's no Dreaming going on there but 837 00:42:02,329 --> 00:41:59,400 there actually is we're pretty much 838 00:42:05,569 --> 00:42:02,339 never have like a blank slate of 839 00:42:09,349 --> 00:42:05,579 consciousness and and that state is 840 00:42:11,329 --> 00:42:09,359 something where night terrors occur 841 00:42:13,130 --> 00:42:11,339 which is different than regular 842 00:42:15,380 --> 00:42:13,140 nightmares because it doesn't not 843 00:42:17,690 --> 00:42:15,390 regular nightmares occur during REM but 844 00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:17,700 these night terrors are are truly 845 00:42:22,370 --> 00:42:20,010 frightening little kids have them with 846 00:42:24,410 --> 00:42:22,380 some frequency and there's content 847 00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:24,420 associated with that usually just these 848 00:42:28,940 --> 00:42:26,490 horrific horrific you know like giant 849 00:42:30,980 --> 00:42:28,950 spiders and things like that that are 850 00:42:33,680 --> 00:42:30,990 chasing them and that's not occurring 851 00:42:36,109 --> 00:42:33,690 during REM so it really makes you wonder 852 00:42:39,250 --> 00:42:36,119 what's going on in this other state of 853 00:42:42,980 --> 00:42:39,260 sleep which we have almost no memory of 854 00:42:45,190 --> 00:42:42,990 now are there different differences in 855 00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:45,200 the way people dream according to their 856 00:42:51,079 --> 00:42:49,050 cultures I'm thinking of possibly about 857 00:42:53,240 --> 00:42:51,089 like good Native American or are there 858 00:42:55,849 --> 00:42:53,250 stories about dreams or things that take 859 00:42:58,280 --> 00:42:55,859 place in dreams that would be a native 860 00:43:00,890 --> 00:42:58,290 to their background but not necessarily 861 00:43:03,740 --> 00:43:00,900 to ours yeah I've seen some research 862 00:43:05,270 --> 00:43:03,750 that indicates that's true that people 863 00:43:07,609 --> 00:43:05,280 from different countries or cultures 864 00:43:09,700 --> 00:43:07,619 have different themes and stories that 865 00:43:12,559 --> 00:43:09,710 are that are more common to them all 866 00:43:16,940 --> 00:43:12,569 right well real quick here Scott on 867 00:43:20,750 --> 00:43:16,950 Twitter wants to know about scientists 868 00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:20,760 and inventors who who say that they may 869 00:43:27,140 --> 00:43:23,970 have gotten their inspiration of their 870 00:43:30,020 --> 00:43:27,150 inventions through their dreams are you 871 00:43:32,059 --> 00:43:30,030 familiar with that concept yeah I looked 872 00:43:34,130 --> 00:43:32,069 at that particularly in the section on 873 00:43:37,580 --> 00:43:34,140 hypnagogia because people 874 00:43:41,090 --> 00:43:37,590 like Edison and painter Salvador Dali 875 00:43:44,060 --> 00:43:41,100 actually developed techniques to just 876 00:43:48,230 --> 00:43:44,070 fall into this this hypnagogic state and 877 00:43:50,570 --> 00:43:48,240 then like in the case of Dali he had 878 00:43:52,490 --> 00:43:50,580 this like metal key that would be held 879 00:43:55,310 --> 00:43:52,500 in his hand and as he kind of fell into 880 00:43:57,980 --> 00:43:55,320 the state the key would plank on to into 881 00:43:59,810 --> 00:43:57,990 into a little tray and then that would 882 00:44:02,180 --> 00:43:59,820 pull him out of it and that's where he 883 00:44:04,340 --> 00:44:02,190 got some of his amazing surrealistic 884 00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:04,350 images kind of dipping into this 885 00:44:10,250 --> 00:44:07,170 subconscious state and seeing some 886 00:44:13,070 --> 00:44:10,260 amazing thing that otherwise would be so 887 00:44:15,350 --> 00:44:13,080 transitory wouldn't be able to grab it 888 00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:15,360 but by waking himself up in that moment 889 00:44:19,090 --> 00:44:18,210 he would kind of seal that image in his 890 00:44:21,260 --> 00:44:19,100 mind 891 00:44:24,110 --> 00:44:21,270 all right well unfortunately we only 892 00:44:25,910 --> 00:44:24,120 have less than three minutes left in the 893 00:44:28,700 --> 00:44:25,920 show so why don't you let our audience 894 00:44:31,280 --> 00:44:28,710 know again the top idol of your book 895 00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:31,290 where they can find it and maybe where 896 00:44:36,590 --> 00:44:34,290 they can find you other places on the on 897 00:44:38,810 --> 00:44:36,600 the web oh well thank you I really 898 00:44:40,850 --> 00:44:38,820 appreciate you guys having me on the 899 00:44:43,940 --> 00:44:40,860 show this evening the book is called 900 00:44:46,970 --> 00:44:43,950 nightmare land it's available on Amazon 901 00:44:50,060 --> 00:44:46,980 in some some bookstores like Barnes & 902 00:44:53,300 --> 00:44:50,070 Noble in Indy books a lot of places 903 00:44:54,740 --> 00:44:53,310 where you would buy books online I think 904 00:44:58,460 --> 00:44:54,750 they did a really great job on the 905 00:45:00,890 --> 00:44:58,470 audiobook so if that's your jam I check 906 00:45:03,260 --> 00:45:00,900 that out the narrator Neal he'll Agurs 907 00:45:06,650 --> 00:45:03,270 kind of has a Rod Serling like voice 908 00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:06,660 that that heightens the material and I 909 00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:08,610 do have my own website for the book it's 910 00:45:15,140 --> 00:45:12,090 called nightmare dot land and yeah feel 911 00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:15,150 free to visit visit me there and send me 912 00:45:21,470 --> 00:45:18,090 a message on the contact page what might 913 00:45:23,840 --> 00:45:21,480 you be working on next well I'm kind of 914 00:45:26,150 --> 00:45:23,850 just riding the wave of this book and 915 00:45:28,070 --> 00:45:26,160 considering some different options one 916 00:45:31,670 --> 00:45:28,080 one and playing around with is maybe 917 00:45:34,070 --> 00:45:31,680 doing a fictional TV series based on 918 00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:34,080 some of the ideas and in the book seems 919 00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:38,810 like kind of a ripe territory to explore 920 00:45:44,450 --> 00:45:42,450 well very very good well it's business 921 00:45:47,569 --> 00:45:44,460 pleasure having you on and much success 922 00:45:50,329 --> 00:45:47,579 with the the book and your writing 923 00:45:53,319 --> 00:45:50,339 career and I'm sure we'll be in contact 924 00:45:56,390 --> 00:45:53,329 I've been on coast to coast now 13 times 925 00:46:03,229 --> 00:45:58,819 I was asking Greg Bishop who has been on 926 00:46:05,719 --> 00:46:03,239 the most times do you have any idea you 927 00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:05,729 know I would if I had to venture gas I 928 00:46:11,029 --> 00:46:07,650 would maybe say someone like Richard C 929 00:46:12,849 --> 00:46:11,039 Hoagland but yes that was my idea yeah 930 00:46:16,849 --> 00:46:12,859 yeah I would I would think so yeah 931 00:46:19,670 --> 00:46:16,859 anyway good night to all and don't 932 00:46:20,719 --> 00:46:19,680 forget to go to the archives k cor 933 00:46:25,130 --> 00:46:20,729 radio.com 934 00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:25,140 and mr. ufos secret files with peters 935 00:46:37,240 --> 00:46:34,030 you've been listening to exploring the 936 00:46:40,750 --> 00:46:37,250 bazaar with hosts Timothy Beckley 937 00:46:43,030 --> 00:46:40,760 panting Swartz they're taking back the 938 00:46:45,580 --> 00:46:43,040 night by jetting non-stop across the 939 00:46:48,880 --> 00:46:45,590 cosmos in search of the truly bizarre 940 00:46:52,240 --> 00:46:48,890 and totally unexplained with you as 941 00:46:56,230 --> 00:46:52,250 their combined Thursday nights at 7:00 942 00:46:58,730 --> 00:46:56,240 p.m. Pacific 10:00 p.m. Eastern on the K 943 00:47:01,310 --> 00:46:58,740 cor digital radio 944 00:47:04,609 --> 00:47:01,320 for more information on exploring the 945 00:47:07,490 --> 00:47:04,619 bazaar and hosts Timothy Becky and Tim 946 00:47:10,579 --> 00:47:07,500 Swartz check out their kco our digital 947 00:47:16,790 --> 00:47:10,589 radio network follow their YouTube 948 00:47:27,200 --> 00:47:16,800 channel @m our UFO 1100 explore the